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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 4:33 pm 
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He's been found guilty of causing death by careless driving.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 4:48 pm 
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That is not enough.

That is so fucking not enough.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 6:03 pm 
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Oh, FFS.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 9:10 pm 
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I'm both unsurprised yet amazed by the fact he got off with a lesser charge.

JUST HOW is driving so close to someone that you drag them off their bike not dangerous?? Knowing the road where it happened makes it even more unfeasible.

A pox upon him.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 11:15 am 
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Baggy wrote:
I'm both unsurprised yet amazed by the fact he got off with a lesser charge.

JUST HOW is driving so close to someone that you drag them off their bike not dangerous?? Knowing the road where it happened makes it even more unfeasible.

A pox upon him.


the word dangerous is a misnomer in this charge.

the test is did his driving fall FAR BELOW the standard of a reasonably competent driver


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 11:19 am 
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unanimously cleared of dangerous driving - ok- can accept the thinking on that ( not that I agree with it)

however it was 11-1 conviction for careless

that seems to imply that 1 member of the jury didn't think that hitting another road user was below the standard of the competent driver ( as opposed to far below for careless)

It is scary to realise people think hitting other road users and killing them is the action of a competent driver


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 12:40 pm 
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spen - having been found guilty of causing death by careless, driving, could he have been made to resit his driving test?

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 12:49 pm 
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More here.

I see the judge: <quote> called for the Government to urgently introduce a special licence and test for tractor drivers </quote> - which what I was sort of getting at earlier.

<quote>

Judge Neligan told the court: "The situation is that a young man is at the wheel of a very large vehicle towing a large trailer. The result through his carelessness is that a lady is killed, without him having any extra driving licence at all.

"It is suprising and horrifying and I hope those in legislation do something without delay."

</quote>

Maybe this is the only good that can come out of an awful thing.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 1:23 pm 
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spen666 wrote:
the test is did his driving fall FAR BELOW the standard of a reasonably competent driver


He left 50cm gap between his tractor and the edge, for a human being who is wider than 50cm. And then hauled a trailer round too with the well-known and obvious throw that trailers have.

That is FAR BELOW competent. RB's been run off the road by these tractor-trailer idiots; they've damn near run me off too.

Cowardly fucking jury. They're not my peers.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 4:10 pm 
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AndyGates wrote:
spen666 wrote:
the test is did his driving fall FAR BELOW the standard of a reasonably competent driver


He left 50cm gap between his tractor and the edge, for a human being who is wider than 50cm. And then hauled a trailer round too with the well-known and obvious throw that trailers have.

That is FAR BELOW competent. RB's been run off the road by these tractor-trailer idiots; they've damn near run me off too.

Cowardly fucking jury. They're not my peers.



Andy - sadly they are your peers.

There are a couple of points that come out of this case


1. the test you are applying is not the legal test- you are putting a slightly different spin on it with your comment [ do not get me wrong, I would have liked to see him convicted of dangerous driving]

2. The allowing of motorists to judge the actions of motorists viz a viz other road users is a bit like asking 12 BNP members to try someone accused of racism


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 9:39 am 
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Reflecting on this case and the posts. I wonder what would be the bwenefits of changing charges of careless and dangerous driving and the related offences eg death by... to
below competent driving and
far below competent driving

This fits better with the tests the court are being asked to perform - ie the public will understand the offences better
also it may make courts more likely to convict if they are focussed on the actual test not the misleading labels of careless and dangerous


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:50 am 
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It seems a sensible idea.

But, it seems that at the moment the collective view of the country (given the lack of outcry generally) is that it is acceptable to save a few seconds here and there by risking other peoples lives.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:27 pm 
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His Hon Neligan? I have had many dealings with him. He is a hard case.

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